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Problem with contacts categories

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John Blackwell - 01 Feb 2006 11:16 GMT
We run MS Outlook 2003 on an Small Business Server 2003 network. We use
Outlook to store circa 8,000 contacts, defined under 14 categories. The
problem we're encountering is, when entering new contacts, the categorisation
is being handled differently by Outlook - i.e. we used to have categories
separated by a comma, now it's a changed to a semi-colon. New contacts will
not recognise two categories, i.e. categorisation such as 'Prospect' and
'Newsletter' will only be recognised as 'Newsletter'.

Before this drives me to distraction, can anyone suggest a fix?
Sue Mosher [MVP-Outlook] - 01 Feb 2006 14:35 GMT
Did users recently change their regional settings in Control Panel? That's where the text delimiter is defined.

You should still be able to set multiple categories on an item, though.

Signature

Sue Mosher, Outlook MVP
  Author of Configuring Microsoft Outlook 2003
    http://www.turtleflock.com/olconfig/index.htm
  and Microsoft Outlook Programming - Jumpstart for
    Administrators, Power Users, and Developers
    http://www.outlookcode.com/jumpstart.aspx

> We run MS Outlook 2003 on an Small Business Server 2003 network. We use
> Outlook to store circa 8,000 contacts, defined under 14 categories. The
[quoted text clipped - 5 lines]
>
> Before this drives me to distraction, can anyone suggest a fix?
John Blackwell - 01 Feb 2006 15:29 GMT
Hi Sue,

Thanks for the quick response. There's been no (conscious) changes to
regional settings.

Our problems occur when we use a second category (we use this to designate
our newsletter is required). It now seems as though Outlook's reached a limit
and insists on using a semi-colon separator.  It also ignores the original
categorisation.

> Did users recently change their regional settings in Control Panel? That's where the text delimiter is defined.
>
[quoted text clipped - 9 lines]
> >
> > Before this drives me to distraction, can anyone suggest a fix?
Sue Mosher [MVP-Outlook] - 01 Feb 2006 15:44 GMT
Details? Number of categories per item? Number of characters? What steps are you following to set categories on items?

Signature

Sue Mosher, Outlook MVP
  Author of Configuring Microsoft Outlook 2003
    http://www.turtleflock.com/olconfig/index.htm
  and Microsoft Outlook Programming - Jumpstart for
    Administrators, Power Users, and Developers
    http://www.outlookcode.com/jumpstart.aspx

> Hi Sue,
>
[quoted text clipped - 19 lines]
>> >
>> > Before this drives me to distraction, can anyone suggest a fix?
John Blackwell - 01 Feb 2006 16:24 GMT
Number of categories per item? For circa 50% of our contacts, it's two. For
the remainder it's one.

Number of characters? The longest category is 12 characters (Public Sector)
or 11 (Competition). When using two categories, its 23 characters (Public
Sector, Newsletter).

What steps are you following to set categories on items?  Categories are
defined in the Master Category list, and then assigned using Categories
dialog box in the bottom right corner of the Contacts pop-up box.

> Details? Number of categories per item? Number of characters? What steps are you following to set categories on items?
>
[quoted text clipped - 21 lines]
> >> >
> >> > Before this drives me to distraction, can anyone suggest a fix?
Sue Mosher [MVP-Outlook] - 01 Feb 2006 16:29 GMT
I'd try running Help | Delete and Repair. Nothing about your configuration or usage suggests a possible cause of the problem.

What exactly happens when you select two categories in the Categories dialog?

Signature

Sue Mosher, Outlook MVP
  Author of Configuring Microsoft Outlook 2003
    http://www.turtleflock.com/olconfig/index.htm
  and Microsoft Outlook Programming - Jumpstart for
    Administrators, Power Users, and Developers
    http://www.outlookcode.com/jumpstart.aspx

> Number of categories per item? For circa 50% of our contacts, it's two. For
> the remainder it's one.
[quoted text clipped - 8 lines]
>
>> Details? Number of categories per item? Number of characters? What steps are you following to set categories on items?

>> > Hi Sue,
>> >
[quoted text clipped - 19 lines]
>> >> >
>> >> > Before this drives me to distraction, can anyone suggest a fix?
Judy Gleeson MVP Outlook - 02 Feb 2006 06:55 GMT
 I hope Sue gets this fixed for you....

 In the meantime - you could make a new Field called Newsletter as a YES/NO
field and check it for people wo are supposed to be sent it.

 This would unclutter your category field too and show that there are lots
of separate pieces of data you can hold about clients.

 Judy Gleeson [MVP Outlook]
 Acorn Training and Consulting
 www.acorntraining.com.au

 Everyone - turn on your Advanced Toolbars and learn how to use the Field
Chooser and Group by Box!!

 I'd try running Help | Delete and Repair. Nothing about your configuration
or usage suggests a possible cause of the problem.

 What exactly happens when you select two categories in the Categories
dialog?

 --
 Sue Mosher, Outlook MVP
    Author of Configuring Microsoft Outlook 2003
      http://www.turtleflock.com/olconfig/index.htm
    and Microsoft Outlook Programming - Jumpstart for
      Administrators, Power Users, and Developers
      http://www.outlookcode.com/jumpstart.aspx

 "John Blackwell" <JohnBlackwell@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in
message news:4A50798A-3BEC-4A53-97B6-E1F66C7F679F@microsoft.com...
 > Number of categories per item? For circa 50% of our contacts, it's two.
For
 > the remainder it's one.
 >
 > Number of characters? The longest category is 12 characters (Public
Sector)
 > or 11 (Competition). When using two categories, its 23 characters
(Public
 > Sector, Newsletter).
 >
 > What steps are you following to set categories on items?  Categories are
 > defined in the Master Category list, and then assigned using Categories
 > dialog box in the bottom right corner of the Contacts pop-up box.
 >
 >
 >
 >> Details? Number of categories per item? Number of characters? What
steps are you following to set categories on items?

 >>
 >> "John Blackwell" <JohnBlackwell@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in
message news:8408D55B-D971-4AAA-AB85-1ABBF75FE17A@microsoft.com...
 >> > Hi Sue,
 >> >
 >> > Thanks for the quick response. There's been no (conscious) changes to
 >> > regional settings.
 >> >
 >> > Our problems occur when we use a second category (we use this to
designate
 >> > our newsletter is required). It now seems as though Outlook's reached
a limit
 >> > and insists on using a semi-colon separator.  It also ignores the
original
 >> > categorisation.
 >> >
 >> >
 >> >> Did users recently change their regional settings in Control Panel?
That's where the text delimiter is defined.
 >> >>
 >> >> You should still be able to set multiple categories on an item,
though.
 >> >>
 >> >> "John Blackwell" <JohnBlackwell@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in
message news:4E6E8480-4790-46CB-85FC-EC9E42A8455A@microsoft.com...
 >> >> > We run MS Outlook 2003 on an Small Business Server 2003 network.
We use
 >> >> > Outlook to store circa 8,000 contacts, defined under 14
categories. The
 >> >> > problem we're encountering is, when entering new contacts, the
categorisation
 >> >> > is being handled differently by Outlook - i.e. we used to have
categories
 >> >> > separated by a comma, now it's a changed to a semi-colon. New
contacts will
 >> >> > not recognise two categories, i.e. categorisation such as
'Prospect' and
 >> >> > 'Newsletter' will only be recognised as 'Newsletter'.
 >> >> >
 >> >> > Before this drives me to distraction, can anyone suggest a fix?
 >> >>
 >>
John Blackwell - 07 Feb 2006 20:57 GMT
Hi Judy,

I'm not sure I fully understand your suggestion.  Where would I create the
new field?

>   I hope Sue gets this fixed for you....
>
[quoted text clipped - 88 lines]
>   >> >>
>   >>
John Blackwell - 07 Feb 2006 20:54 GMT
Hi Sue,

I've run Delete & Repair and still get the same issue.

When I select two categories, Outlook now decides to assign a semi-colon
separator rather than a comma as it previously used. It also swaps the order
of new categorisation, placing 'Newsletter' before any other category.
Finally, it decides to only display one category rather than both.  It's all
very puzzling.

The net result is that I have to export the entire contact db on a regular
basis, clean it, and reimport it.  Not a satisfactory process.

> I'd try running Help | Delete and Repair. Nothing about your configuration or usage suggests a possible cause of the problem.
>
[quoted text clipped - 36 lines]
> >> >> >
> >> >> > Before this drives me to distraction, can anyone suggest a fix?
Sue Mosher [MVP-Outlook] - 07 Feb 2006 22:23 GMT
Did you ever check Regional Settings in Control Panel to see what the list separator is?

When you say it displays only one category rather than both, where are you seeing that behavior?

Signature

Sue Mosher, Outlook MVP
  Author of Configuring Microsoft Outlook 2003
    http://www.turtleflock.com/olconfig/index.htm
  and Microsoft Outlook Programming - Jumpstart for
    Administrators, Power Users, and Developers
    http://www.outlookcode.com/jumpstart.aspx

> Hi Sue,
>
[quoted text clipped - 49 lines]
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > Before this drives me to distraction, can anyone suggest a fix?
John Blackwell - 07 Feb 2006 22:59 GMT
Sorry Sue, I forgot to mention I'd done this action and (a) there had not
been any changes, and (b) the settings were set to United Kingdom.

> Did you ever check Regional Settings in Control Panel to see what the list separator is?
>
[quoted text clipped - 53 lines]
> >> >> >> >
> >> >> >> > Before this drives me to distraction, can anyone suggest a fix?
Sue Mosher [MVP-Outlook] - 08 Feb 2006 03:25 GMT
But what, specifically, is the separator setting? Did you click the Advanced button to look?
Signature

Sue Mosher, Outlook MVP
  Author of Configuring Microsoft Outlook 2003
    http://www.turtleflock.com/olconfig/index.htm
  and Microsoft Outlook Programming - Jumpstart for
    Administrators, Power Users, and Developers
    http://www.outlookcode.com/jumpstart.aspx

> Sorry Sue, I forgot to mention I'd done this action and (a) there had not
> been any changes, and (b) the settings were set to United Kingdom.
[quoted text clipped - 56 lines]
>> >> >> >> >
>> >> >> >> > Before this drives me to distraction, can anyone suggest a fix?
John Blackwell - 08 Feb 2006 07:41 GMT
Hello Sue,

The separator setting is set to comma.  I did indeed check the Advanced
settings and that is also set to English (United Kingdom).

We have not made any changes to these settings and have been using Outlook
2003 to store our ~ 8,000 contacts for the last 3 years. The problems arose
when we recently added the extra Newsletter category and tried to use 2
categories for some contacts.  It's been from this point forward that we've
experienced the issues we've described.

> But what, specifically, is the separator setting? Did you click the Advanced button to look?
> > Sorry Sue, I forgot to mention I'd done this action and (a) there had not
[quoted text clipped - 57 lines]
> >> >> >> >> >
> >> >> >> >> > Before this drives me to distraction, can anyone suggest a fix?
Sue Mosher [MVP-Outlook] - 08 Feb 2006 13:38 GMT
Does the problem occur only when the Newsletter category is added? Is there any possibility that you have some add-in installed that's also operating on these items? I have to ask because the behavior you describe doesn't match any Outlook problems I've ever heard of.

Signature

Sue Mosher, Outlook MVP
  Author of Configuring Microsoft Outlook 2003
    http://www.turtleflock.com/olconfig/index.htm
  and Microsoft Outlook Programming - Jumpstart for
    Administrators, Power Users, and Developers
    http://www.outlookcode.com/jumpstart.aspx

> Hello Sue,
>
[quoted text clipped - 69 lines]
>> >> >> >> >> >
>> >> >> >> >> > Before this drives me to distraction, can anyone suggest a fix?
John Blackwell - 08 Feb 2006 14:11 GMT
Unfortunately the problem occurs across several different
'double-categorisation' configs.  Equally, there is nothing we have
consciously added-in to cause this problem.

Always dangerous to come up with an uninformed opinion but it "feels" as
though we've reached a contact capacity issue with Outlook.

> Does the problem occur only when the Newsletter category is added? Is there any possibility that you have some add-in installed that's also operating on these items? I have to ask because the behavior you describe doesn't match any Outlook problems I've ever heard of.
>
[quoted text clipped - 71 lines]
> >> >> >> >> >> >
> >> >> >> >> >> > Before this drives me to distraction, can anyone suggest a fix?
Sue Mosher [MVP-Outlook] - 08 Feb 2006 14:27 GMT
8000 contacts isn't all that many, IMO. I think I have 3000 on my desktop in a PST file. I've heard of public folders with 20,000+, but usually on a machine with dual processors and lots of RAM. You might want to look at perf stats on the server to see if there's a problem there.

Is there a custom Outlook form involved? Any event sink on the folder?

You could also perform a simple test to see if the same problem occurs in a contacts folder in a .pst file. That might suggest whether it's a server or client issue.

Signature

Sue Mosher, Outlook MVP
  Author of Configuring Microsoft Outlook 2003
    http://www.turtleflock.com/olconfig/index.htm
  and Microsoft Outlook Programming - Jumpstart for
    Administrators, Power Users, and Developers
    http://www.outlookcode.com/jumpstart.aspx

> Unfortunately the problem occurs across several different
> 'double-categorisation' configs.  Equally, there is nothing we have
[quoted text clipped - 76 lines]
>> >> >> >> >> >> > not recognise two categories, i.e. categorisation such as 'Prospect' and
>> >> >> >> >> >> > 'Newsletter' will only be recognised as 'Newsletter'.
Judy Gleeson MVP Outlook - 09 Feb 2006 07:37 GMT
 sorry John - was away for a bit:

 Make a new field using the field chooser.    New | make a yes/no type of
field called Newsletter.

 Use it to do your grouping (Group By Box) .  All of these functions are on
Advanced toolbar.
 --

 Judy Gleeson [MVP Outlook]
 Acorn Training and Consulting
 www.acorntraining.com.au

 Everyone - turn on your Advanced Toolbars and learn how to use the Field
Chooser and Group by Box!!

 8000 contacts isn't all that many, IMO. I think I have 3000 on my desktop
in a PST file. I've heard of public folders with 20,000+, but usually on a
machine with dual processors and lots of RAM. You might want to look at perf
stats on the server to see if there's a problem there.

 Is there a custom Outlook form involved? Any event sink on the folder?

 You could also perform a simple test to see if the same problem occurs in
a contacts folder in a .pst file. That might suggest whether it's a server
or client issue.

 --
 Sue Mosher, Outlook MVP
    Author of Configuring Microsoft Outlook 2003
      http://www.turtleflock.com/olconfig/index.htm
    and Microsoft Outlook Programming - Jumpstart for
      Administrators, Power Users, and Developers
      http://www.outlookcode.com/jumpstart.aspx

 "John Blackwell" <JohnBlackwell@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in
message news:A271A894-B205-4542-9920-30BE4101735A@microsoft.com...
 > Unfortunately the problem occurs across several different
 > 'double-categorisation' configs.  Equally, there is nothing we have
 > consciously added-in to cause this problem.
 >
 > Always dangerous to come up with an uninformed opinion but it "feels" as
 > though we've reached a contact capacity issue with Outlook.
 >
 >
 >
 >> Does the problem occur only when the Newsletter category is added? Is
there any possibility that you have some add-in installed that's also
operating on these items? I have to ask because the behavior you describe
doesn't match any Outlook problems I've ever heard of.
 >>
 >> "John Blackwell" <JohnBlackwell@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in
message news:328E7AF8-3F17-4C94-822E-D95862BD578F@microsoft.com...
 >> > Hello Sue,
 >> >
 >> > The separator setting is set to comma.  I did indeed check the
Advanced
 >> > settings and that is also set to English (United Kingdom).
 >> >
 >> > We have not made any changes to these settings and have been using
Outlook
 >> > 2003 to store our ~ 8,000 contacts for the last 3 years. The problems
arose
 >> > when we recently added the extra Newsletter category and tried to use
2
 >> > categories for some contacts.  It's been from this point forward that
we've
 >> > experienced the issues we've described.
 >> >
 >> >
 >> >> But what, specifically, is the separator setting? Did you click the
Advanced button to look?
 >> >>
 >> >> "John Blackwell" <JohnBlackwell@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in
message news:16C561CD-E13F-4F8D-BEBB-4B9DB1FF8836@microsoft.com...
 >> >> > Sorry Sue, I forgot to mention I'd done this action and (a) there
had not
 >> >> > been any changes, and (b) the settings were set to United Kingdom.
 >> >> >
 >> >> >
 >> >> >> Did you ever check Regional Settings in Control Panel to see what
the list separator is?
 >> >> >>
 >> >> >> When you say it displays only one category rather than both,
where are you seeing that behavior?
 >> >> >>
 >> >> >>
 >> >> >> "John Blackwell" <JohnBlackwell@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote
in message news:7C114945-7086-483B-BD3B-7EB2CE126A1C@microsoft.com...
 >> >> >> > Hi Sue,
 >> >> >> >
 >> >> >> > I've run Delete & Repair and still get the same issue.
 >> >> >> >
 >> >> >> > When I select two categories, Outlook now decides to assign a
semi-colon
 >> >> >> > separator rather than a comma as it previously used. It also
swaps the order
 >> >> >> > of new categorisation, placing 'Newsletter' before any other
category.
 >> >> >> > Finally, it decides to only display one category rather than
both.  It's all
 >> >> >> > very puzzling.
 >> >> >> >
 >> >> >> > The net result is that I have to export the entire contact db
on a regular
 >> >> >> > basis, clean it, and reimport it.  Not a satisfactory process.
 >> >> >> >
 >> >> >> >
 >> >> >> >
 >> >> >> >
 >> >> >> >> I'd try running Help | Delete and Repair. Nothing about your
configuration or usage suggests a possible cause of the problem.
 >> >> >> >>
 >> >> >> >> What exactly happens when you select two categories in the
Categories dialog?
 >> >> >> >>
 >> >> >> >>
 >> >> >> >> "John Blackwell" <JohnBlackwell@discussions.microsoft.com>
wrote in message news:4A50798A-3BEC-4A53-97B6-E1F66C7F679F@microsoft.com...
 >> >> >> >> > Number of categories per item? For circa 50% of our
contacts, it's two. For
 >> >> >> >> > the remainder it's one.
 >> >> >> >> >
 >> >> >> >> > Number of characters? The longest category is 12 characters
(Public Sector)
 >> >> >> >> > or 11 (Competition). When using two categories, its 23
characters (Public
 >> >> >> >> > Sector, Newsletter).
 >> >> >> >> >
 >> >> >> >> > What steps are you following to set categories on items?
Categories are
 >> >> >> >> > defined in the Master Category list, and then assigned using
Categories
 >> >> >> >> > dialog box in the bottom right corner of the Contacts pop-up
box.
 >> >> >> >> >
 >> >> >> >> >
 >> >> >> >> >
 >> >> >> >> >> Details? Number of categories per item? Number of
characters? What steps are you following to set categories on items?
 >> >> >> >>
 >> >> >> >> >>
 >> >> >> >> >> "John Blackwell" <JohnBlackwell@discussions.microsoft.com>
wrote in message news:8408D55B-D971-4AAA-AB85-1ABBF75FE17A@microsoft.com...
 >> >> >> >> >> > Hi Sue,
 >> >> >> >> >> >
 >> >> >> >> >> > Thanks for the quick response. There's been no
(conscious) changes to
 >> >> >> >> >> > regional settings.
 >> >> >> >> >> >
 >> >> >> >> >> > Our problems occur when we use a second category (we use
this to designate
 >> >> >> >> >> > our newsletter is required). It now seems as though
Outlook's reached a limit
 >> >> >> >> >> > and insists on using a semi-colon separator.  It also
ignores the original
 >> >> >> >> >> > categorisation.
 >> >> >> >> >> >
 >> >> >> >> >> >
 >> >> >> >> >> >> Did users recently change their regional settings in
Control Panel? That's where the text delimiter is defined.
 >> >> >> >> >> >>
 >> >> >> >> >> >> You should still be able to set multiple categories on
an item, though.
 >> >> >> >> >> >>
 >> >> >> >> >> >> "John Blackwell"
<JohnBlackwell@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
news:4E6E8480-4790-46CB-85FC-EC9E42A8455A@microsoft.com...
 >> >> >> >> >> >> > We run MS Outlook 2003 on an Small Business Server
2003 network. We use
 >> >> >> >> >> >> > Outlook to store circa 8,000 contacts, defined under
14 categories. The
 >> >> >> >> >> >> > problem we're encountering is, when entering new
contacts, the categorisation
 >> >> >> >> >> >> > is being handled differently by Outlook - i.e. we used
to have categories
 >> >> >> >> >> >> > separated by a comma, now it's a changed to a
semi-colon. New contacts will
 >> >> >> >> >> >> > not recognise two categories, i.e. categorisation such
as 'Prospect' and
 >> >> >> >> >> >> > 'Newsletter' will only be recognised as 'Newsletter'.
 
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