Q: inserting LISTNUM levels in doc

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Malcolm Dew-Jones - 19 Jan 2006 19:26 GMT

I am using Word 2000

I have LISTNUM fields in a document. When I wish to add a
cross-reference then word displays a menu of listnums that
looks very much like a table of contents from which to choose
the link.

I want to embed something similar to that menu in my document.

It seems I can't just use a TOC because the TOC isn't based on
the LISTNUM fields. (I played with footnotes (instead of
listnum), but the hierachy of the listnum is important and
word automatically rearranges the levels if the document
changes, which is important to me.)

Suggestions on how best to do this would be appreciated.

E.G.

The document looks like this

    1) This is about the widgets. 1.1) They are green
    and 1.2) they are old.

    2) Also consider the gadgets. 2.1) They are red
    and 2.2) they are new, or 2.3) they have been
    refurbished.

    Lets talk about the colour (see 1.1 and 2.1) of the
    different items in use, and their age (see 1.2, 2.2,
    2.3).

I want to include a section at the end of the document that can
be automatically updated (like a TOC) and that looks like

    1) This is about the widgets.
    1.1) They are green and
    1.2) they are old.
    2) Also consider the gadgets.
    2.1) They are red and
    2.2) they are new, or
    2.3) they have been refurbished.

That is basically the same as what word shows in the cross reference
dialog.

I did some quick experiments with VB, though I am not an expert in VB
so some intelligent use of word options would be better.

Also, in VB, I can find each listnum field, but I don't see how to
get the level numbers from the field after I find it.

    Selection.NextField.Select
    Set my_obj = Selection

    MsgBox (my_obj.Text) ' show the field contents

    my_obj.XXX how do I get the listnum level numbers?

As I said, suggestions on how best to do this would be appreciated.

Thanks, Malcolm

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Dawn Crosier - 20 Jan 2006 18:26 GMT

I would setup your listnums with a custom styles. Then you can use
the TOC where you use only the style to set it up.

\t "Style,Level,Style,Level,..." Builds a Table of Contents from
paragraphs formatted with styles other than the built-in heading
styles. For example, {TOC \t "chaptertitle,1, chapterhead,2"} builds
a table of contents from paragraphs formatted with the styles
"chaptertitle" and "chapterhead". The number after each style name
indicates the table of contents entry level that corresponds to that
style.

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Dawn Crosier
Microsoft MVP
"Education Lasts a Lifetime"

This message is posted to a newsgroup. Please post replies and
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>I am using Word 2000
>
[quoted text clipped - 59 lines]
>
> Thanks, Malcolm

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Malcolm Dew-Jones - 20 Jan 2006 21:23 GMT

: I would setup your listnums with a custom styles. Then you can use
: the TOC where you use only the style to set it up.

: \t "Style,Level,Style,Level,..." Builds a Table of Contents from
: paragraphs formatted with styles other than the built-in heading
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
: indicates the table of contents entry level that corresponds to that
: style.

That's an interesting thing to know thanks, but the issues then are
two fold.

Surely, to use that I first have to assign the correct style to each
part of the text, which is a lot more manual work that just inserting
the listnum field (one keystroke, correct level assigned
automatically) plus occasionally increasing or decreasing the level
(one more keystroke, tab or shift+tab, and again, the field
automatically tracks the correct level when I do this).

Also, if I rearrange the text (for example if a paragraph becomes
subordinate to something else) then surely I would have to go through
and change all the styles within the paragraph to change each level
that was flagged, whereas the listnum field handles all the changes
automatically.

I suppose I could write a VB macro to "raise" and "lower" the styles
so as to sort-of automate the process of changing levels.

Or perhaps I misunderstand the capabilities of how styles work.

: This message is posted to a newsgroup. Please post replies and
: questions to the newsgroup so that others can learn as well.

: >I am using Word 2000
: >
[quoted text clipped - 59 lines]
: >
: > Thanks, Malcolm

Reply to this Message

Malcolm Dew-Jones - 20 Jan 2006 22:09 GMT

: : I would setup your listnums with a custom styles. Then you can use
: : the TOC where you use only the style to set it up.

: : \t "Style,Level,Style,Level,..." Builds a Table of Contents from
: : paragraphs formatted with styles other than the built-in heading
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
: : indicates the table of contents entry level that corresponds to that
: : style.

: That's an interesting thing to know thanks, but the issues then are
: two fold.

: Surely, to use that I first have to assign the correct style to each
: part of the text, which is a lot more manual work that just inserting
[quoted text clipped - 8 lines]
: that was flagged, whereas the listnum field handles all the changes
: automatically.

In fact there is a third issue with using styles. It ties the look of
the text into the level of the hierarchy that I am marking, but the
two are not necessarily related that closely.

For example, in some places a section title (large font, centered etc)
could correspond to what I consider a top level category, whereas in
other places each of a list of items discussed in a paragraph (regular
font, etc) will be what I consider a top level category.

If the document was created from scratch then that issue might be a
flag to the writer that the logical arrangement of the document should
be improved. However the documents already exist, and I just wish to
mark them up for cross referencing and to generate a TOC-like list of
the things of interest to me.

For some documents I will not even need to consider eveything in the
document, and for them the hierarchy of my list may never completely
correspond to the layout of the document even if the document could be
rearranged.

I am thinking more and more that I need to use VB to solve this. I am
thinking I will maintain my own TC markers, one for each listnum. Each
TC would take its level from the level of the listnum (which Word
maintains automatically) and the text of the TC would be copied from
the text of the document following the listnum. I have automated most
of that now by simply recording a macro and tweaking it, BUT I need to
know the level of the listnum and I have not yet figured out how to
get that information.

So, information on how to get the level of a listnum from within VB
would be most appreciated. (This is word 2000).

Thanks, malcolm.

: : This message is posted to a newsgroup. Please post replies and
: : questions to the newsgroup so that others can learn as well.

: : >I am using Word 2000
: : >
[quoted text clipped - 59 lines]
: : >
: : > Thanks, Malcolm

: --

Reply to this Message

Dawn Crosier - 20 Jan 2006 22:40 GMT

Malcolm -

I agree that if the document is volatile that styles may not work for
you, however, styles is how I would format the list. I would be sure
and setup a keyboard shortcut so that when I moved text around, I
could easily re-assign the style. Frankly, the style would have no
additional formatting than you already have in your document, but your
next question was how do you find the actual number of the paragraph
where you have applied ListNum:

Try this to see if it will return what you want it to do.
http://word.mvps.org/FAQs/Numbering/ListString.htm

Signature

Dawn Crosier
Microsoft MVP
"Education Lasts a Lifetime"

This message is posted to a newsgroup. Please post replies and
questions to the newsgroup so that others can learn as well.

> : : I would setup your listnums with a custom styles. Then you can
> use
[quoted text clipped - 153 lines]
>
> : --

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John McGhie [MVP - Word and Word Macintosh] - 27 Jan 2006 21:02 GMT

Tricky :-)

* You will HAVE to use the TOC Generator to compile the list -- it's the
only one that will give you a result ordered by the position in the document
in which the numbers appear.

* You can generate the TOC using either Styles or TC field tags. You
cannot use the default TOC mechanism, which uses Outline Levels.

I would use Styles. Create a style for each level of numbering you require.
You might name the styles "ListNum TOC 1", "ListNum TOC 2", etc...

When defining the style, make sure that the Paragraph Properties "Outline
Level" field is se to "Body Text" (if it is not, the TOC generator will try
to override your sequence when it compiles).

Apply the appropriate style to each of the ListNum paragraphs.

Now insert a TOC into your document. In Insert>Index and Tables>Table of
contents, click the Options button (I'm working in Mac Word at the moment,
so I would try to tell you exactly where these commands are, you'll find
them easily enough...)

Make sure that the top option, "Build Table of Contents from..." is set to
STYLES, and that the bottom on, "TC Fields" is set to OFF. It is also
critical to ensure that that you specify a "Format" of "From Template" when
you insert the TOC. If you specify any other format, Word ignores all your
hard work and re-writes your specifications each time the TOC generates.

Each paragraph in a style you nominate here will be listed in your Table of
Contents. Place an integer in the box beside each style name you want in
the TOC. The integer determines the LEVEL at which the TOC Generator
compiles paragraphs with the nominated style.

Set to blank in this dialog any style you do not want listed. You may find
that the default styles Heading 1 through Heading 4 have numbers against
them already: if they have, you should remove those numbers to prevent these
styles being listed in your TOC.

Now: Is this going to be the main (only...) TOC in the document? If not,
you will have to bookmark the section of the document that you want the TOC
generator to compile entries for this particular TOC from, and specify the
name of the bookmark (it's case sensitive, and no spaces allowed...)
correctly in the TOC field.

The user interface may not allow you to do this (depending on your version
of Word) you may have to switch on Field Codes and insert the syntax by
hand. You only have to do this once: once you have edited the field codes
generating the TOC field, they will stay correct. Obviously you are aware
that editing the text of the TOC is utterly pointless: the text is removed
and replaced each time the TOC regenerates.

I did say you could also do this by adding TC tags around each piece of text
you want to appear in the TOC. I would go to any lengths to avoid this,
because putting the tags in is such a laborious task, and maintaining them
as you edit the document is an absolute PITA. But you "can" do it if you
have a high tolerance for pain. The only time I would use TC fields is if I
want the style of the text in the body of the document to be independent of
the level of the resulting entry in the TOC (e.g. To have entries from
Heading 2, Heading 3 and Heading 4 paragraphs to appear at TOC level 2).
Wanting that sort of thing is a bit like wanting your neighbour's wife: it
indicates there is something very wrong with the fundamentals of your
document design :-) I work very hard to ensure that I never want that :-)

Get back to us if you need any more help.

On 19/1/06 7:26 PM, in article 43cfe7f7$1@news.victoria.tc.ca, "Malcolm
Dew-Jones" <yf110@vtn1.victoria.tc.ca> wrote:

> I am using Word 2000
>
[quoted text clipped - 58 lines]
>
> Thanks, Malcolm

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me unless I ask you to.

John McGhie <john@mcghie.name>
Microsoft MVP, Word and Word for Macintosh. Consultant Technical Writer
Sydney, Australia +61 (0) 4 1209 1410

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